Quoting Dale Shipp to Jim Weller <=-

"Families with chickens in the yard were reluctant to kill their egg-laying hens, though by the time those hens finished their
usefulness as layers, they were tough old birds, fit only for
stew."

I miss buying old stewing hens for soups and stews. My store no
longer stocks them. When Ray and Neekha lived on the rural acreage
near Peace River a few years ago (after Yellowknife and before
Edmonton) he bought a couple of dozen old hens and one rooster (for
just a buck a piece!) from a nearby Mennonite farm which produced eggs
on a commercial basis. Those hens still laid eggs but just 3 or 4
and eventually 1 or 2 a week vs 6-7. Over the course of the
following year they were all slaughtered one by one and they all
made fantastic meals. Two of them made it to my place.

beef producers were butchering veal in order to thin their herds

Actually that would be dairy farmers, not beef producers. And beef
producers didn't want to buy male dairy calves as those breeds
didn't gain as much weight on the same amount of pasture and feed.
A full grown Black Angus can hit 2200 lb but a Jersey just 1200 lb.
OTOH A Jersey cow produces twice as much milk daily as an Angus cow.

making veal more common and less expensive than chicken.

At least in the late spring and early summer when the just barely
weaned calves go to market. Fall calves and yearlings lack the good
qualities of both veal and mature beef and is hardly ever sold.

Here's a dish that works well with veal or chicken. A Piccata
usually has capers as well as lemon juice but this one doesn't.

MMMMM----- Recipe via Meal-Master (tm) v8.06

Title: Turkey Cutlets Piccata
Categories: Turkey, Chicken, Veal, Eggs, Dairy
Yield: 4 Servings

16 oz Fresh turkey cutlets
1 Large egg
1 tb Milk
1 1/2 c Fresh bread crumbs
Butter or margarine
1 Medium sized lemon
1 Envelope chicken bouillon
1/4 ts Salt
4 Parsley sprigs for garnish

About 40 minutes before serving, pound cutlets with a mallet until
each is about 1/8 of an inch thick. If cutlets are large cut into
desired serving pieces. In pie plate, beat egg with milk until
blended. On wax paper place bread crumbs. Dip cutlets in egg mixture,
then in crumbs to coat.

In a skillet over medium-high heat melt 4 tbls butter and cook
turkey cutlets, a few pieces at a time, until browned on both
sides, adding more butter or margarine if necessary. Remove
cutlets to plate. Reduce heat to low. Squeeze juice of half lemon
into dripping in skillet; stir in bouillon, salt and 1/4 cup of
water until blended, scraping to loosen brown bits from bottom of
skillet. Return turkey to skillet; cover and simmer 5 minutes or
until turkey cutlets are fork tender. Thinly slice remaining half
of lemon.

To serve, garnish turkey cutlets with lemon slices and parsley
sprigs. This same recipe can be used for chicken or veal. I serve
it with what we call yellow rice. I purchase this as a mix in a
bag with all the other packages of preseasoned rice mixes.

Original poster not noted.

The bouillon packet probably has more than enough salt in it.
Don't add more. Indian yellow rice is made with turmeric. Latin
American yellow rice is made with annatto. Rich People's yellow
rice is made with Saffron. - JW

MMMMM

Cheers

Jim

... I want beef not veal. I don't believe in eating babies.

___ Blue Wave/QWK v2.20
--- Platinum Xpress/Win/WINServer v3.0pr5
* Origin: Fidonet Since 1991 www.doccyber.org bbs.docsplace.org (1:135/392)

On 09-18-21 21:15, Jim Weller <=-
spoke to Dale Shipp about Veal vs. chicken <=-

beef producers were butchering veal in order to thin their herds

Actually that would be dairy farmers, not beef producers. And beef producers didn't want to buy male dairy calves as those breeds
didn't gain as much weight on the same amount of pasture and feed.
A full grown Black Angus can hit 2200 lb but a Jersey just 1200 lb.
OTOH A Jersey cow produces twice as much milk daily as an Angus cow.

making veal more common and less expensive than chicken.

You are right -- I was thinking about the dairy farmers.

At least in the late spring and early summer when the just barely
weaned calves go to market. Fall calves and yearlings lack the good qualities of both veal and mature beef and is hardly ever sold.

When I was growing up in Florida the local Publix chain sold something
they called "baby beef". I now believe it was meat from the calves and yearlings you mention above. I don't recall any real difference in
flavor, but then my palette was only beginning to develop then (three
score and ten years ago).


MMMMM----- Recipe via Meal-Master (tm) v8.05

Title: Greek Lentil Soup
Categories: Vegetarian, Lentils, Greek, Soup, D/g
Yield: 6 servings

1 c Red lentils
1 c Brown lentils
6 c Water
3 Knoor Veg. Cubes
1/2 sm Onion, diced
1 Carrot, diced
1 Rib celery, diced
1/8 ts Celery seed
3 tb Dried potato buds*
1 lg Potato, diced
2 tb Olive oil
2 Bay leaves
2 ts Red wine vinegar (Optional)

Mix all ingredients except the vinegar in a soup pot and cook until
the lentils are very soft, about one hour. Stir in vinegar at the
end, and serve.

NOTE: Brought soup to boil, turned down and simmered uncovered 45
min.

If using homemade veg. stock, add salt to taste.

*If thinner soup is desired, omit potato buds, or use lesser amount.
Used 3 quart sauce pan.
Adapted from: Laurel's Kitchen
Typed by Gail & Dale Shipp

MMMMM



... Shipwrecked in Silver Spring, Maryland. 00:07:24, 20 Sep 2021
___ Blue Wave/DOS v2.30

--- Maximus/NT 3.01
* Origin: Owl's Anchor (1:261/1466)

Dale Shipp wrote to Jim Weller <=-

When I was growing up in Florida the local Publix chain sold something they called "baby beef". I now believe it was meat from the calves and yearlings you mention above. I don't recall any real difference in flavor, but then my palette was only beginning to develop then (three score and ten years ago).

Baby beef is to cattle as hogget is to lamb.

Some animals are harvested slightly later, after they're weaned from
formula and have begun to eat grass or grain. At this stage they're 5
to 6 months old, and they can reach up to 600 pounds in weight. Their
meat is sometimes marketed as "grass-fed veal" or "grain-fed veal," but
this isn't entirely candid. While cuts from these animals are paler
and tenderer than mature beef, they're not as mild and delicate as
veal from animals that haven't been weaned. In regions where this type
of meat is commonly sold, it's frequently described as baby beef so
purchasers won't feel misled. (Cribbed from ehow.com)

Then we get into yearling beef - which is another can of worms.

Two recipes - one of which I've made.

MMMMM----- Recipe via Meal-Master (tm) v8.06

Title: Baby Beef Liver & Onions
Categories: Offal, Vegetables
Yield: 4 Servings

2 lg Onions; peeled, quartered,
- sliced thin
4 tb Oil
1 Bay leaf
Salt & pepper
1 lb Baby beef liver
2 tb Butter
2 tb Vinegar

Using a non-stick skillet, heat 1 tablespoon of the oil
(use 2 tablespoons for uncoated skillet), over medium
high heat and add the onions, bay leaf, salt and pepper.
Cook, stirring occasionally, until onions are golden
brown, about 20 minutes. Remove pan contents to a bowl
and keep warm.

Meanwhile, cut the sliced liver into strips about 1/2"
wide and about 2" long. After removing onions from
skillet, add another tablespoon of oil (more if needed)
to the skillet, turning the heat up to high. When the
oil is very hot, almost smoking, add the strips of
liver, stirring rapidly and turning the strips so they
brown evenly. Cook about 2 to 4 minutes, then drain in
a colander.

Return the heat to medium high, add the butter to the
skillet, add the liver and toss, and add the onions and
stir. Add the vinegar, stir briefly to blend and serve
immediately, garnished with chopped parsley if desired.

This goes well with thin noodles or rice.

Serves 4.

RECIPE FROM: https://www.cooks.com

Uncle Dirty Dave's Kitchen

MMMMM

MMMMM----- Recipe via Meal-Master (tm) v8.06

Title: Roast Baby Beef
Categories: Beef, Vegetables, Herbs, Potatoes
Yield: 6 Servings

3 lb Baby beef roast; (topside)
8 Baby potatoes; rinsed,
- halved
2 md White onions; rinsed; rough
- chopped
1 Head garlic; rinsed, peeled,
- rough chopped
1 bn Thyme
1 bn Rosemary
Extra-virgin olive oil
Salt & fresh ground pepper

Remove beef from fridge 30-45 minutes before it goes in
the oven.

Set oven @ 475ºF/245ºC.

Place vegetables in the bottom of baking dish along with
thyme and rosemary. Drizzle with olive oil and season with
salt and pepper.

Rub beef all over with a generous amount of olive oil and
season with salt and pepper.

Nestle beef on top of vegetables, place in oven and lower
to 400ºF/205ºC.

Cook roast beef for 50-60 minutes, or until desired
doneness is reached.

Remove from oven and let rest 15-20 minutes, covered with
aluminum foil.

Slice thinly and serve with your preference of vegetables.

Recipe adapted from Jamie Oliver

Serves 6

Recipe from: http://12tomatoes.com/

Uncle Dirty Dave's Archives

MMMMM

... "To be pleased with one's limits is a wretched state" -- Goethe

--- EzyBlueWave V3.00 01FB001F
* Origin: Tiny's BBS - telnet://tinysbbs.com:3023 (1:229/452)

On 09-21-21 10:34, Dave Drum <=-
spoke to Dale Shipp about Veal vs. chicken <=-

Baby beef is to cattle as hogget is to lamb.

Good analogy. I'd heard of Hogget from our friends down under when they
were posting hear, but had all but forgotten it. There was also a
description having to do with two-teeth or something like that.


MMMMM----- Recipe via Meal-Master (tm) v8.05

Title: Potato Pakoras / Cakes
Categories: Appetizer, Indian, Vegetable
Yield: 4 servings

1/2 c Besan (lentil or chick-pea
- flour)
1 tb Ground rice
1/2 ts Salt or to taste
1 1/2 ts Ground coriander
1 ts Ground cumin
1/2 ts Chili powder
1/4 c Water
3 md Potatoes, peeled and
-into 1/4" slices
Oil for deep frying

Mix all the dry ingredients in a large bowl. Add the water and mix to
thick paster. Add the potatoes and mix until the potato slices are fu
coated with the paste. Heat oil over medium heat in a deep pan and put
as many of the coated potatoes the pan will hold in a single layer. F
the pakoras until golden brown, 6-8 mintues. Drain on paper towel.

Serve on their own with drinks or as a side dish of meat, fish, chicke
curry; or as a appetizer with avocado Chutney.
Recipe from the complete Indian cookbook.

Date: 05-23 From: Tanana Reynolds

MMMMM



... Shipwrecked in Silver Spring, Maryland. 01:09:47, 22 Sep 2021
___ Blue Wave/DOS v2.30

--- Maximus/NT 3.01
* Origin: Owl's Anchor (1:261/1466)

Dale Shipp wrote to Dave Drum <=-

Baby beef is to cattle as hogget is to lamb.

Good analogy. I'd heard of Hogget from our friends down under when
they were posting hear, but had all but forgotten it. There was also a description having to do with two-teeth or something like that.

IIRC "one-tooth hogget" was older than lamb but less than 1 year old.
"Two tooth hogget" bridged the gap between yearling and mature sheep.

I think, given the cut line on this recipe it's a British term originally.

MMMMM----- Recipe via Meal-Master (tm) v8.06

Title: Roast Hogget
Categories: Five, Lamb/mutton, Vegetables, Herbs
Yield: 6 Servings

4 1/2 lb (2 kg) part-boned, rolled
- leg of hogget
1 tb Olive oil
1 sm Bunch rosemary; broken in
- sprigs
3 cl Garlic; thin sliced
4 Anchovies; into small pieces
- (optional)

Heat oven 220+.C/425+.F(200+.C/390+.F fan)/gas 7.

Weigh the meat (if you don't know the weight already)
and calculate the cooking time: 15 mins per 450g/16 oz
for rare, 20 mins for medium and 25 mins for well-done.

Place the meat in a roasting tray, rub all over with the
oil and season generously with salt and pepper. Use the
tip of a sharp knife to make incisions all over the joint,
then in each one insert sprigs of rosemary with a sliver
of garlic and piece of anchovy, if using. Put the meat in
the oven for 10 mins, then turn down to 180+.C/360+.F(160+.C
320+.F fan) gas 4.

Now roast for your calculated time, basting the meat
occasionally with any pan juices. Remove from the oven
and rest the joint for at least 15 mins before carving.

Recipe from Good Food magazine, June 2010

From: http://www.bbcgoodfood.com

Uncle Dirty Dave's Archives

MMMMM

... A dinner divested of ceremony, is an act of perfidy. Anonymous

--- BBBS/Li6 v4.10 Toy-5
* Origin: Prism bbs (1:261/38)