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From: Paul <
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Newsgroups: microsoft.public.windowsxp.general
Subject: Re: Dell 780 Problem:
Date: Sat, 25 Nov 2017 22:09:52 -0500
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Mark Twain wrote:
Let's max out the 780,.. the only thing
we did when I got it was add a video card
I believe.
Could this be it? I had it bookmarked.
https://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814130635
Since were going to max out the DIMMS is
there anything else I should do? Like add
another fan? (a quiet one)
I presently have it sitting on the floor
(on a board) do you think I should raise it
for better airflow? The 8500 is sitting on top
of my old 486 tower I use as a pedestal base
and painted it black. It brings the 8500 at the
perfect level to the desk. The 780 is next to
it.
Since were going to max out the 780,.. $150 - $200
do we need to continue the DIMM tests? Should
I run the test for all the new DIMMS?
I'll let you select the new DIMMS as if it were your
computer and go with your choice as I did with selecting
the Dell 780.
Once you give me your selection I'll buy it when I can
and then let you know,..
Many Thanks,
Robert
Well, you know the spec for what you've got,
and that the Dell info said DDR3-1066/1333. Which
DIMM speeds it might use, might depend on the CPU
FSB. Third-party motherboards running a Q45 Northbridge
(which houses the memory controller), would
allow other choices for memory divider and could
run at a different speed as a result.
CT25664BA1067.M8FR
DDR3-1066 (PC3-8500) CL7 UDIMM 240 pin
First the chipset info. Now, what this means is, at the time
of release, the Q45 chipset supported 16GB max on DDR2 designs
and 8GB max on DDR3 designs. Intel errs on the conservative
side when it releases this info, which is a shame. It should
instead be "honest" that capabilities exist, and simply
say "we haven't tested the 16GB config yet". Which would
be fine by me and would reduce my apprehension level.
https://s7.postimg.org/3yuujdaor/chipset_info.gif
People are confused by this here.
https://www.bleepingcomputer.com/forums/t/603198/dell-optiplex-780-dt-16gb-ram- issue-conflicting-information/
One of the links they reference, is this one. Page 9
says "Yes, you can have 4x4GB DDR3 on the 780". That means
Intel actually supported it, but Intel was not able
to test or say much else when Q45 was released. But,
the Dell info neglects to mention an important detail,
which is single-sided versus double-sided RAM. The Dell
info works when the DIMM is double-sided at the 4GB density
point. Probably at the point in time Dell released
this information, that's the only kind of DIMM available
for this purpose.
http://i.dell.com/sites/content/business/solutions/engineering-docs/en/Document s/optiplex-780-tech-guide.pdf
One of the links referenced from Bleepingcomputer, takes
you here. The people here don't necessarily know what
they're doing either. Except the guy here recommended
getting the RAM from Crucial. The difficult part, is
finding a picture of the Crucial product, to make sure it's
double sided.
http://en.community.dell.com/support-forums/desktop/f/3514/t/19460832
The Crucial DDR3L-1600 is double sided and has chips
on both sides. In the DDR3 generation, some sticks
came out (I own a bunch), where the 4GB DIMM is single
sided and the 8GB DIMM is double sided. Those are 4Gbit
per silicon die, whereas the value outside of the
Q45 spec is to use 2Gbit per silicon die. The reason
the Crucial is working, is the config is a lower
density than some others you could buy.
The industry no longer makes 2Gbit chips, and instead
the DDR3 market is flooded with 4Gbit chips. That means
there will be a *lot* of single-sided 4GB DIMM products
attempting to trick you into purchase.
So while the GSkill are cute, with their heatspreader
and all, they might not work on the Optiplex 780.
Whereas the Crucial ones might. It's too bad we cannot
see the other side of these in the following advert,
to verify they're double sided (and hence, "low density")
in the picture. If only Crucial would include pictures
of both sides for our convenience.
But these are the ones to buy. Two sets if you want 16GB DDR3
on Optiplex 780.
**************************************************************
*
* $76 a set, buy two sets for four sticks. Your price in USD
* may differ, as some web pages are location-sensitive.
*
*
http://www.crucial.com/usa/en/optiplex-780-mini-tower/CT7339272
*
**************************************************************
I tried Kingston.com and they don't list any entry for
the Optiplex 780. I looked at datasheets for three of their
ValueRAM products, and they're single sided. So Kingston
didn't put these in their list for the 780, even though
they would fit in the DIMM socket and all. Kingston makes
the shopping process easier, by providing this info, but
then again, Kingston doesn't have any lower density ones
for sale. These Kingston products would be based on
the (readily available) 4Gbit silicon dies.
(Non-candidates, do not use)
https://www.kingston.com/dataSheets/KVR13N9S8K2_8.pdf https://www.kingston.com/dataSheets/KVR16LN11_4.pdf https://www.kingston.com/dataSheets/KVR16N11S6_2.pdf
So what happens when you plug in the Crucial ?
Crucial spec DDR3L-1600 CAS11 1.35V
Opti 780 DDR3-1066 CAS7 or CAS8 depending 1.5V
The memory will run at the chipset limit, which is 1066.
The BIOS gets to compute the CAS, and the value is 7.32.
If I had the SPD table for the RAM, I would be better
able to decide whether the actual allowed value is
rounded to 7 or to 8. Your current memory is CAS7
for comparison. The new memory could be CAS7 (faster)
or CAS8 (slower) when it gears down to the lower
clock speed of 1066.
And yes, when the memory arrives, you test it.
Procedure:
1) Shut down machine. Unplug. Use antistatic strap which
is clipped to bare metal on the computer chassis. I use
an I/O screw for my antistatic strap.
2) Remove old RAM. Store in antistatic bag. Insert new
RAM, making sure it "clicks" and is fully seated. Check
that the gold contacts are "hidden" by the socket, using
a flashlight.
3) Plug in computer. Switch on. If the POST screen is
visible, it'll report 16GB. If the wrong density of
RAM is used (GSkill sticks), it would only show 8GB.
Half the memory is detected if you use a high density stick.
4) *Only* boot the machine with the memtest CD at first.
*Don't* boot to Windows first thing. You want to make sure
the RAM passes memtest before you think of booting Windows.
Note that, even when a computer passes memtest, the RAM can
still be bad. I had one poster, who got a pass on memtest,
but Windows was corrupted on boot. So it does happen.
I normally run Prime95 from a Linux LiveCD as my second test
case after memtest, but I don't expect you to want to do
something like that. Maybe some day, someone will figure out
a way to package both tests into the same CD. But that
possibility isn't here today to the best of my knowledge.
HTH,
Paul
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