In playing with xoscope on a Pi4 equipped with an ALSA sound
capture device it looks as if the xoscope installed by apt
has been compiled without ALSA support. This conjecture comes
from:
https://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=888704

Looks like it's fixed in 2.2-2, but apt installs 2.2
Is there any point in making a noise, if so, where?

I'll attempt to compile xoscope 2.3 from source now,
but gtk3+ (named gtk+3 for some reason) is turning
out to be huge. I hope it's enough 8-)

Thanks for reading,

bob prohaska
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On Sun, 02 May 2021 18:41:54 +0000, bob prohaska wrote:

In playing with xoscope on a Pi4 equipped with an ALSA sound capture
device it looks as if the xoscope installed by apt has been compiled
without ALSA support. This conjecture comes from: https://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=888704

Looks like it's fixed in 2.2-2, but apt installs 2.2 Is there any point
in making a noise, if so, where?

I'm not as familiar with the Debian/Raspbian bug reporting culture and attitudes as I am with that of Fedora, though I have bug reportings
logins for both Fedora and Raspbian.

In your shoes I'd probably raise a bug on the grounds that if nobody
raises a bug the package will remain uninstallable and won't get fixed.
Then if I didn't want to wait for a fix to appear, I'd download and
compile from source - and add comments to my previous bug if the source
failed to compile.

I'm in a similar position with Audacity: the current version crashes if I
try to record from an old Ion MixMeister ADC, and so does the previous
(2.4.2 version) though both were fine in the past. The Audacity gang
apparently don't have any similar ADCs so I'm currently helping to sort
sort the problem out - bit of a faff since I'm not a fan of debuggers
like gdb, preferring to work with run-time tracing rather than poring
over crashdumps: when you've developed projects using standard languages
(C, COBOL, PL/I) and standardish OSen (Unices, OS/400, VME/B), much more hardware specific kit like debuggers gets old fairly fast, but as always
its a matter of horses for courses and YMMV.


--
Martin | martin at
Gregorie | gregorie dot org
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bob prohaska <bp@www.zefox.net> wrote:

In playing with xoscope on a Pi4 equipped with an ALSA sound
capture device it looks as if the xoscope installed by apt
has been compiled without ALSA support. This conjecture comes
from:
https://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=888704

Oh right, should have read that post before replying in the other
thread then. Could have saved digging up that same part of the
README the hard way (by downloading the source).

Looks like it's fixed in 2.2-2, but apt installs 2.2
Is there any point in making a noise, if so, where?

Well there is a guide:
https://www.debian.org/Bugs/Reporting

I don't know if there's much point, because honestly I've always
been too lazy to jump through all the right hoops, so never gone
through with reporting a Debian bug.

--
__ __
#_ < |\| |< _#
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On Sun, 2 May 2021 18:41:54 -0000 (UTC), bob prohaska <bp@www.zefox.net> declaimed the following:

Looks like it's fixed in 2.2-2, but apt installs 2.2
Is there any point in making a noise, if so, where?

Probably not... xoscope 2.2-3 is currently in the "testing" version of Debian "Bullseye" (Debian 11).
https://packages.debian.org/testing/x11/xoscope I don't envision the Debian crew back-fitting it to "stable" (Buster).

Which means that, shortly after Bullseye goes "stable", the Raspberry foundation should begin (actually, they may already be using "testing" for preparation) to configure a RaspiOS based upon it.

You could try https://packages.debian.org/bullseye/armhf/xoscope/download and see if you
can manually install the .deb file on Buster...

I suspect you'll end up with lots of dependencies (newer versions) that are not in "Buster".


--
Wulfraed Dennis Lee Bieber AF6VN
wlfraed@ix.netcom.com http://wlfraed.microdiversity.freeddns.org/

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Martin Gregorie <martin@mydomain.invalid> wrote:

On Sun, 02 May 2021 18:41:54 +0000, bob prohaska wrote:

In playing with xoscope on a Pi4 equipped with an ALSA sound capture
device it looks as if the xoscope installed by apt has been compiled
without ALSA support. This conjecture comes from:
https://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=888704

Looks like it's fixed in 2.2-2, but apt installs 2.2 Is there any point
in making a noise, if so, where?

I'm not as familiar with the Debian/Raspbian bug reporting culture and attitudes as I am with that of Fedora, though I have bug reportings
logins for both Fedora and Raspbian.

In your shoes I'd probably raise a bug on the grounds that if nobody
raises a bug the package will remain uninstallable and won't get fixed.

The puzzle is _where_ to raise the bug. Starting from https://www.raspberrypi.org/
it isn't at all clear where bugs should be reported. Almost like
the Foundation doesn't _want_ bug reports. Part of the trouble is
likely mixed parentage: RaspiOS is a Debian derivative, so who's
responsible? There's no hint at raspberrypi.org.

Then if I didn't want to wait for a fix to appear, I'd download and
compile from source - and add comments to my previous bug if the source failed to compile.

I did try to download and compile xoscope 2.3 from github. It looks
like the configure script fails. There's no very explicit guidance on
how to specify an ALSA-compatible build, either. Since ALSA seems to be
the only choice on the Pi that's a serious hurdle.

In the meantime it turned out that a build of xoscope on FreeBSD
worked without a hitch; recognized the audio capture device and
displayed reasonable waveforms. I will admit that the behavior of
xoscope is somewhat obscure to somebody who learned about 'scopes on
500 series Tektronix instruments equipped with Polaroid cameras 8-)

I'm in a similar position with Audacity: the current version crashes if I
try to record from an old Ion MixMeister ADC, and so does the previous
(2.4.2 version) though both were fine in the past. The Audacity gang apparently don't have any similar ADCs so I'm currently helping to sort
sort the problem out

At least there's a group of developers to help. Xoscope is much, much
more obscure. But, you make a point, the program developers are maybe
the folks who have the most interest in seeing things work.

I'll hold my peace for now, as I'm not sure xoscope will do what I
want. It has the bandwidth and resolution needed, but triggering
behavior is most confusing.

Thanks for writing!

bob prohaska




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Dennis Lee Bieber <wlfraed@ix.netcom.com> wrote:

On Sun, 2 May 2021 18:41:54 -0000 (UTC), bob prohaska <bp@www.zefox.net> declaimed the following:

Looks like it's fixed in 2.2-2, but apt installs 2.2
Is there any point in making a noise, if so, where?

Probably not... xoscope 2.2-3 is currently in the "testing" version of
Debian "Bullseye" (Debian 11). https://packages.debian.org/testing/x11/xoscope I don't envision the Debian crew back-fitting it to "stable" (Buster).

Which means that, shortly after Bullseye goes "stable", the Raspberry foundation should begin (actually, they may already be using "testing" for preparation) to configure a RaspiOS based upon it.

You could try https://packages.debian.org/bullseye/armhf/xoscope/download and see if you can manually install the .deb file on Buster...

I suspect you'll end up with lots of dependencies (newer versions) that
are not in "Buster".

There does seem to be a "chain of command", in that Debian originates software, Raspberrypi.org modifies it and folks like me attempt to install and use it.

If I find something that doesn't work, is it my fault, raspberrypi.org's
fault, or Debian's fault? First burden is on me, next seems to be raspberrypi.org and if they can't fix it the problem is Debian's. If
Debian can't fix it the problem comes back to me.

Thanks for writing,

bob prohaska
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On Mon, 3 May 2021 01:57:43 -0000 (UTC)
bob prohaska <bp@www.zefox.net> wrote:

The puzzle is _where_ to raise the bug. Starting from https://www.raspberrypi.org/
it isn't at all clear where bugs should be reported. Almost like
the Foundation doesn't _want_ bug reports. Part of the trouble is
likely mixed parentage: RaspiOS is a Debian derivative, so who's
responsible? There's no hint at raspberrypi.org.

In Debian, you would use reportbug. This is available on the Pi, and
presumably has been tweaked to send the report to the right place. It
isn't installed by default.

Everywhere a package is modified should be in the bug loop i.e. the Pi maintainers first, then Debian, then the mysterious 'upstream'. Whoever
fixes the bug, if the bug came from further up the chain, will report
it and probably provide a patch. If the bug comes from further
upstream and is fairly fundamental, it will be passed up the chain.

--
Joe

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On Mon, 03 May 2021 01:57:43 +0000, bob prohaska wrote:

I'll hold my peace for now, as I'm not sure xoscope will do what I want.
It has the bandwidth and resolution needed, but triggering behavior is
most confusing.

In the past I've reported Raspbian bugs here: https://www.raspbian.org/RaspbianBugs

... but I don't remember how I found the raspbian.org website or the but reporting part of it.




--
Martin | martin at
Gregorie | gregorie dot org
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On Mon, 03 May 2021 02:20:09 +0000, bob prohaska wrote:

There does seem to be a "chain of command", in that Debian originates software, Raspberrypi.org modifies it and folks like me attempt to
install and use it.

Cough: ITYM Raspbian.org, since they own the OS and bug reporting system, although they're most likely to be the software part of the Raspberry Pi organisation.

If I find something that doesn't work, is it my fault, raspberrypi.org's fault, or Debian's fault? First burden is on me, next seems to be raspberrypi.org and if they can't fix it the problem is Debian's. If
Debian can't fix it the problem comes back to me.

That looks about right, though if it crashes on take-off without any
Mayday message the finger points pretty directly at raspbian.org

Similarly, my first port of call for anything in a package installed from
the Fedora repository is the Fedora bugzilla regardless of who wrote and/
or maintain the packaged code. I think this is the usual and expected
approach for most Linux distros.


--
Martin | martin at
Gregorie | gregorie dot org
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Joe <joe@jretrading.com> wrote:

In Debian, you would use reportbug. This is available on the Pi, and presumably has been tweaked to send the report to the right place. It
isn't installed by default.

Everywhere a package is modified should be in the bug loop i.e. the Pi maintainers first, then Debian, then the mysterious 'upstream'. Whoever
fixes the bug, if the bug came from further up the chain, will report
it and probably provide a patch. If the bug comes from further
upstream and is fairly fundamental, it will be passed up the chain.

The bug has been reported, thank you for letting me know about reportbug!

bob prohaska

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On Mon, 3 May 2021 10:34:35 -0000 (UTC), Martin Gregorie <martin@mydomain.invalid> wrote:

In the past I've reported Raspbian bugs here: https://www.raspbian.org/RaspbianBugs

... but I don't remember how I found the raspbian.org website or the but reporting part of it.

cat /etc/os-release
--
Regards
Kees Nuyt

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